First let me give some back ground. I've played Shadowrun for about 20 years now, and I love it. It's been one of my favorite games consistently for a variety of reasons: quality of ideas; quality of writing; quality of inspiration. (Notice Crunch doesn't make my top three list. That's important.)
However my vision of the game, I think, vastly differs from what I see as the average "Cyberpunk" game out there. I draw my inspiration from a variety of sources-my career in Law Enforcement, my time in the Military (Hey does Derek still post around here these days?); popular culture (Movies like Heat, Ronin, The Way of the Gun, and more. Comic Books like Fables, The Walking Dead, and many more. Music like Aphex Twin, NIN, Machines of Loving Grace, etc...) My game is more Noir in some respects, definitely grittier, and far less "Punk" than how the game is presented.
Now I get we all get to bring our own vision's to the table, and that's fun. So please don't think I'm missing that point. Iget the Gamer Police won't show up on my door step if I don't use YoTC, or stuff I don't like. I also get the people selling the game aren't doing it for free, and that one of the many ways they keep the game alive is attracting a new market.
Now all of that said this thread is inspired by a post I've quoted below, and is intended to be a discussion of what it means to be a Professional Criminal, which I believe is different from Criminal, and certainly much removed from "Violent" and "Unstable". So feel free to contribute, try not take it too personal, and most of all have fun!
A Note
I've removed the specific poster's name from this post, although I am sure any one can easily figure out who posted it. My intent is not to single this poster out, and harass them. Rather their post inspired me to make this post, and it's been one of the more fun posts I've written for any forum in a long while. Please respect this user's privacy, and please refrain from getting to harsh. I've tried to keep my comments lighthearted, and tried to refrain from making it a personal attack. (I'm not sure if I succeeded, and if I failed my apologies.)
Well see here's the rub my friend. There's professional criminals and there's Professional Criminals. I work in a prison, and I am around people who've chosen Crime as a profession all day nearly every day. There's a pretty huge difference, in my book, between a Thug and a Professional. Anyone can commit a crime. It's pretty easy. Sure society tries to differentiate between "Serious" crimes and "Non-serious" crimes. (Or if you prefer violent, non violent, property damage, etc...etc...) but the fact is we're really bad at it. Most people get away with more crimes than they are caught for.Ok, let's go over this again: we're talking about professional criminals.
Talk to any convict and they'll tell you that they committed tens, if not hundreds of offenses prior to being committed. Even more after they've been committed.
Being a Criminal is like any other job. Some people care about what they do, and how they do it. Some guys are going to burn the place down if we take their stapler one last time. Being a good criminal, in a lot of ways, is like being a good soldier or spy, or actor. In fact it sort of involves being all of those things at once in order to be successful. (A term I reluctant to use, successful, because it's subjective. We'll all define it just a little differently.)
To me the point of a "Shadowrunner" (Seriously? Who would say that? Who? No one that's who.) is that you aren't some jack ass with a day glow mohawk drawing attention to what you're doing. You're a nameless, faceless, anonymous ghost in the machine. You can be anyone. You can be anywhere. You can do anything. (Or at least make people believe you can.) That doesn't mean you're an amoral slob who'd jump out of a bush to touch kids funny. Even hardened killers (There are few of these in reality, most people kill one or a few people whom they tend to know well enough to be emotionally invested into.) have codes of conduct.
Ah but not every job has to be illegal, and not every crime is equal, or even unjust. Just because you commit crime for money doesn't mean you have to take any job that comes along. Every criminal, just like anyone else, has different goals. Some are obviously less noble than others....who hire themselves out for the purposes of committing crimes.
I think this is way too narrow of a definition, and utter bullshit to boot. It's nothing personal, but if that were true wouldn't playing Shadowrun amount to some sort emo sadomasochistic circle jerk? Even the game as presented isn't about being an amoral, unstable, violent, insane monster. Maybe that's how you roll, but in my game that shit would get you tossed out on your ass, unless you had a story to tell.In all probability, they are violent, unstable, and quite possibly clinically insane.
I think all of that can be true, but those are the guys who get caught, and do hard, hard time. For every action there is an equal but opposite reaction. Remember that? No where is it more true than law enforcement. Ever been pulled over? Were a prick to the cop writing you a ticket? No? Why not? Because he could shoot your ass, right? Or write another ticket. Or search your car. Contempt of Cop is a pretty common offense, especially inside prison walls. (No that doesn't make it right, or even common place. It is what it is. I am not saying every cop is dirty, or that every cop is looking to bust your balls.)They probably shoot or otherwise seriously injure and/or kill people routinely as a matter of course, have little to no respect for authority, and are probably breaking all kinds of laws just because of the stuff they own, never mind the stuff they do.
Kill a boat load of people in my game, and guess what? Local, County, State, National, and International Law Enforcement people start looking for you. Unless it's the job to kill, why bother? A wounded security guard can only press charges against you for malicious wounding, felonious assault, and/or felon in possession of a firearm, right? A dead security has friends, family, and murder charges following you.
So yes, Use of Force is a tool in every Professional Criminal's tool box. But just like working in law Enforcement there should be a Use of Force Continuum. This isn't perfect but here's a decent example:
(Not sure why this isn't displaying, but just in case The Link
Notice it starts with Presence.
Presence is commonly defined as
Follow up on each level, and their appropriate response. Use of Force is not cut and dried. Nor should it be. You don't use a screw driver to hammer a nail, and you don't use a hammer to open jars. The right tool for the right job.Officer Presence. The mere presence of a highly visible uniform security officer or marked vehicle is often enough to stop a crime in progress or prevent future crime. Included in officer presence are standing, walking, running, and use of vehicle lights, horn, or speaker. Without saying a word, an alert officer can deter crime or direct criminals away from a property by use of body language and gestures. At this level gestures should be non-threatening and professional.
I think you either don't know anyone who works as a Private Investigator, or perhaps you just don't get the game as written (At the minimum you have a vastly different idea of what the game is, or how I understand it to be commonly understood.). While I agree that currently Police Corruption isn't anywhere near the levels it's portrayed as being at in Popular Culture, the News media, and other forms of entertainment (Make no mistake the News Media is selling you the news my friend. They're not nonprofits.); I think that misses the mark of the game is envisioned. It's a Dystopian Future where there are fewer checks and balances on authority; where violence is more common place and accepted at a level that would make International Prime time news these days.Private investigators and bodyguards don't dabble as Shadowrunners. They don't break into high security facilities and steal prototypes or kidnap people. They don't commit arson or assassinate people. certainly, some of them will have appropriate skill sets to be Shadowrunners, but that is a very different thing from being a hired professional criminal.
For all intents and purposes there is little difference between Shadowrunners, P.I.'s and Body Guards. In fact I'd suggest that Investigative Work, and Body Guard are types of jobs some Shadowrunners could take. (The idea that all Shadowrunners have to be Professional Criminals is a box I don't feel the need to limit my players or game to.)
So can every day people. Every member of this board, whether they want to believe it or not, is capable of any of these acts. Some may have actually committed them. Single parents kidnap. Soccer moms steal. Priest's commit arson. Everyday people assassinate each other every day. It's called murder.Shadowrunners do kidnap and steal. They can commit arson, assassinate people, and all kinds of other crimes.
A Shadowrunner can do these things. Or conversely they can choose not to. Haven't you ever seen the wrongly convicted Hero strive for his freedom? (Hey Harrison Ford in the Fugitive, I'm looking at you!) You need some more Pop Culture exposure my friend!
Or not. You do realize how many people have Warrants right? In times past these warrants have been issued by Creditors, Jealous wives, angry coworkers...Let's just say it's not always a judge of what's really going on. That said, i do think you're somewhat correct. A high enough profile criminal will attract some attention, these could take the forms of Warrants, etc... That's one consequence to use on players who are sloppy.Odds are good that they're wanted under one or more alias in several countries, and the only reason they aren't wanted in more is because those crimes haven't been linked to them (yet).
You keep saying this. Why? Why is it true? Why is it like that in your game? Why limit yourself to that single definition?We're not talking about sane, stable people here. We're talking about people who are not capable of functioning in normal society, for the most part.
Now I address all of this to you, but I should mention I'm not trying to put you on the spot here. You certainly don't have to answer, and I am certainly not trying to say your a bad person, or anything like that. I just trying to understand how you have your fun at your table, while explaining how we have fun at ours.
That perfectly describes a lot of people under arms: Police men, Fire Men, the Military. Money isn't everything right?People who have skills that could allow them to get a high-paying job where they aren't likely to get shot at, and instead choose to routinely risk getting shot in the face.
Man how unfun is your game? Even in real life not all criminals are drunk or high when they commit crimes. I think you're bringing a personal chip to the table man. I think the game would be more fun if you left it behind.Assuming that you can trust violent psychopaths who were probably drunk/high/chipping when you called them but not licensed professionals who've probably received some degree of training in their job and who carry the added plus of not being violent sociopaths?
Wow, do you have any fun when playing? Look I'm not sure how to say this any better, but the best Criminal's are the well adjusted ones. The ones that fit right in. The violent psychopaths don't last long. Even in real life they burn out and fade away, getting old takes the piss and vinegar out of most people. Few people can be angry all of their lives.Perhaps your specific group of Shadowrunners are a bunch of stable, well-adjusted people who for some random unfathomable reason just like risking their lives on a regular basis. But that is not likely to be the standard in a group consisting entirely of highly skilled individuals who've chosen a life of crime.
I think you need to take a serious look at what you think of the game, and re-examine it. I think you'd have more fun if you let up a little. I'm sorry this has taken a slightly personal twist at the end, and obviously if you're having fun then who am I to tell you how to have your fun?
Now onto remarks inspired by your post:
A Shadowrunner is a Professional. Like any Professional they have a code of conduct they adhere to, be it No women, no kids, or something more concrete. Just because you're a Shadowrunner doesn't mean you're SINless, or even a criminal. The game allows you to do more than that. Just like not every PC is a Mage or a Street Sam-not every "Run" is illegal, immoral or illicit.
Build an internally consistent world folks. Don't be afraid to make the game work for you, and make it fun.
Okay tear me apart! Tell me what you see Shadowrunners as being? What is your definition of a Professional Criminal? Do Shadowrunners in your game get Shoe Endorsements? Are they heroes? Are they antiheros? Are they villains? Is your game a wanton bout of blood soaked violence? Is it a puzzle trap that would make Grimtooth shudder? Is it a pop culture reference fest?
Speak the Word.